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#1 2009-03-09 01:51:36

Wade_
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The Manilla tell all story :)

Following some of the threads i noticed there were discussion about Manilla sim points and what level chems we had.

To confirm it yes we did have 1 lvl 7http://www.courtrivals.com/images/chemistry_icon_7.jpg , 2 lvl 6   http://www.courtrivals.com/images/chemistry_icon_6.jpg, 2 lvl 5  http://www.courtrivals.com/images/chemistry_icon_5.jpg . We missed the other lvl 7 by a day sad, the midseason transfer kind of screwed that up(Bgirls fault! wink ).

This resulted in over 120,000 post slider sim pts. I'm glad to be the plan creator big_smile

Heres a few things before you look at the screen shot

On a Hole Notha Level had a grease monkey script error. He really had 7,000 higher(his player page worked).
The sliders were changed throughout the season. So attribute totals were different throughout the season(we tried many scenario's). The screen shot is an example of what i would say was the avg of where we had stuff. For example we had a lot more leadership then what is shown when we played TSS.


These attribute totals aren't totals that we played TSS with

http://i43.tinypic.com/6dy2w4.jpg
Can you see why everyone's quitting?
If you don't believe me, pm Tyler King. He helped me with the screen shot, thank you Tyler.
I know our defense was low for the starters and our lead wasn't that high(we raised a bunch towards playoffs, i think it was 10,000 each lineup). I won't release what chems or skills used, but for most out there i don't think i have too.




Stat Distribution:


I don't think this was too shocking considering KC has already said we had high level chems(although some didn't believe it unless they had visual evidence). But the intriguing part about it is our player stats.

First Player
-Dwyane Wade had about 12,000 total BH/Passing, and how many assists did he get? 2.7
-Ray Allen same thing as Wade
-Lord Jabu Jabu had 6,000 blocking, and had 1.7 blocks?
-Iron Curtain had about 6,000 defense and had 1.2 steals(i know speed is part of it)
-Alsmost As Cool As Malice had close to 11,000 3pt shooting, which resulted in 8 pts?

I think it quite apparent when the sim decides player stats, it look at pre-adjusted attributes(which would make sense looking at out stats and our players pre-adjusted attributes). But when it decides which team gets that stat, it looks at post slider pts as it should. I know other people have caught this already, yes you fastasaturtle, but this basically just proves it to all those doubters out there.




You may ask why i would make this thread? Well basically as you all know Manilla is disbanding anyways so it doesn't matter for one. and two, there were many doubters out there i had to prove it.

         
I've been proud to play with one of CR greatest teams, i thank rowellg for that opportunity. And i want to say one more think about rowellg, i may have created the plan but he executed it to perfection. What i mean by that is he trained like crazy, i think he's up their with Hyphy when it comes to training. I'm disappointed i wasn't able to help bring Manilla to the glory land, but i don't think its necessary for this team. Manilla will always be remembered. For great members, and great teams


My future is unknown, i will decide my fate in the next couple of days when i get more time to think about it. Hearing kazz make new sim changes will probably make me stick around for one more season. I'm not sure about Mike G or the other guys on the team. I do know rowellg, KC, and Dman will be leaving.




I'm truthfully anxious to what other top teams total was. FU had about 85,000 last season, and now went to 120,000 season. I wonder what it will be next. Slightly was right, the bar was raised high with 110,000(actually 120,000), but i think FU can eclipse it with all the smart people they have.

Great win TSS, not many teams can say they beat a team with 120,000 sim pts. 

Wow, just wow. I'm still in shock we lost tonight, GL to the rest of the teams in the playoffs. I'm predicting a Prolific Penguins - Pawutket finals


P.S. I hope there wasn't to many spelling errors or fucked up sentences(slightly smile ), but its like 1am here and i haven't slept good all weekend.

Last edited by Wade_ (2009-03-09 15:11:11)


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#2 2009-03-09 01:55:19

Camel
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

http://www.courtrivals.com/images/chemistry_icon_7.jpg  wink

Last edited by Camel (2009-03-09 01:55:36)


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#3 2009-03-09 01:56:19

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)


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#4 2009-03-09 02:01:13

FastAsATurtle
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Wade_ wrote:

thank you smile

Nice story. Not entirely unexpected, but still good to see it confirmed.

Quick question: how would you get to a 3rd lvl7? This seems difficult.

Last edited by FastAsATurtle (2009-03-09 02:01:39)


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#5 2009-03-09 02:01:54

HanesOnU
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Wade_ wrote:

I think it quite apparent when the sim decides player stats, it look at pre-adjusted attributes(which would make sense looking at out stats and our players pre-adjusted attributes). But when it decides which team gets that stat, it looks at post slider pts as it should. I know other people have caught this already, yes you fastasaturtle, but this basically just proves it to all those doubters out there.

More than just Fastasaturtle knew this... you just tried to act as if you were brilliant b/c your build made that extremely obvious. ANd it isn't that simple either.


Wade_ wrote:

I'm truthfully anxious to what other top teams total was. FU had about 85,000 last season, and now went to 120,000 season. I wonder what it will be next. Slightly was right, the bar was raised high with 110,000(actually 120,000), but i think FU can eclipse it with all the smart people they have.

FU had around 65k last season.


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#6 2009-03-09 02:02:51

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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

That is simply amazing. I've never seen as much 3's as michael nelson has post sliders/chems/sp's.

I'm just in awe, how did MG not win it this season? As I mentioned before, FU had around 65-70k TOTAL last season when we won it all. All I can think of is that maybe MG had poor game planning in terms of sliders and team chems etc. Nothing else seems to make sense. A team with that many final points should take the title easily.

Good plan, wade. I would never have guessed anyone had reached level 7 yet.

Looks like we know what FU needs to do next season.


"When I play ball I really like to bang with the big men down low. I'm pretty aggressive but sometimes bobbling balls is a challenge-you've just got to really reach in there and really get a firm hold. When it comes down to it, I really just have to pound it up in there if I want to score" -MyNetsForLife

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#7 2009-03-09 02:04:19

FastAsATurtle
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Slightly Hyphy wrote:

That is simply amazing. I've never seen as much 3's as michael nelson has post sliders/chems/sp's.

I'm just in awe, how did MG not win it this season? As I mentioned before, FU had around 65-70k TOTAL last season when we won it all. All I can think of is that maybe MG had poor game planning in terms of sliders and team chems etc. Nothing else seems to make sense. A team with that many final points should take the title easily.

Good plan, wade. I would never have guessed anyone had reached level 7 yet.

Looks like we know what FU needs to do next season.

Please do smile


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#8 2009-03-09 02:04:57

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

HanesOnU wrote:

Wade_ wrote:

I think it quite apparent when the sim decides player stats, it look at pre-adjusted attributes(which would make sense looking at out stats and our players pre-adjusted attributes). But when it decides which team gets that stat, it looks at post slider pts as it should. I know other people have caught this already, yes you fastasaturtle, but this basically just proves it to all those doubters out there.

More than just Fastasaturtle knew this... you just tried to act as if you were brilliant b/c your build made that extremely obvious. ANd it isn't that simple either.


Wade_ wrote:

I'm truthfully anxious to what other top teams total was. FU had about 85,000 last season, and now went to 120,000 season. I wonder what it will be next. Slightly was right, the bar was raised high with 110,000(actually 120,000), but i think FU can eclipse it with all the smart people they have.

FU had around 65k last season.

i know you knew about smile, i just remember me and fastasaturtle talked about it. if i came across as if i was brilliant about then i'm sorry, all i could do was hint at it so our plan wasn't totally revealed.


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#9 2009-03-09 02:05:26

Slightly Hyphy
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

FastAsATurtle wrote:

Slightly Hyphy wrote:

That is simply amazing. I've never seen as much 3's as michael nelson has post sliders/chems/sp's.

I'm just in awe, how did MG not win it this season? As I mentioned before, FU had around 65-70k TOTAL last season when we won it all. All I can think of is that maybe MG had poor game planning in terms of sliders and team chems etc. Nothing else seems to make sense. A team with that many final points should take the title easily.

Good plan, wade. I would never have guessed anyone had reached level 7 yet.

Looks like we know what FU needs to do next season.

Please do smile

Please do what? neutral


"When I play ball I really like to bang with the big men down low. I'm pretty aggressive but sometimes bobbling balls is a challenge-you've just got to really reach in there and really get a firm hold. When it comes down to it, I really just have to pound it up in there if I want to score" -MyNetsForLife

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#10 2009-03-09 02:06:01

Slightly Hyphy
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Did MG use Gym Rat at all this season?


"When I play ball I really like to bang with the big men down low. I'm pretty aggressive but sometimes bobbling balls is a challenge-you've just got to really reach in there and really get a firm hold. When it comes down to it, I really just have to pound it up in there if I want to score" -MyNetsForLife

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#11 2009-03-09 02:06:42

Doctor #46
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

That is simply a ridiculous amount of points....but still you guys should have moved more points into leadership...i know of multiple leadership players who eclipse that amount of leadership on their own...and guess what...it was in the 4th where you guys lost it...so yeah


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#12 2009-03-09 02:06:42

FastAsATurtle
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Slightly Hyphy wrote:

Did MG use Gym Rat at all this season?

This is something, that should be left to the beholder to figure out. You have all the info you need wink


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#13 2009-03-09 02:06:53

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Slightly Hyphy wrote:

That is simply amazing. I've never seen as much 3's as michael nelson has post sliders/chems/sp's.

I'm just in awe, how did MG not win it this season? As I mentioned before, FU had around 65-70k TOTAL last season when we won it all. All I can think of is that maybe MG had poor game planning in terms of sliders and team chems etc. Nothing else seems to make sense. A team with that many final points should take the title easily.

Good plan, wade. I would never have guessed anyone had reached level 7 yet.

Looks like we know what FU needs to do next season.

Yea are game planning wasn't the best i'm sure, but still. Good luck to you guys next season SH, i'm already picking you guys as my favorite.


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#14 2009-03-09 02:08:08

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Doctor #46 wrote:

That is simply a ridiculous amount of points....but still you guys should have moved more points into leadership...i know of multiple leadership players who eclipse that amount of leadership on their own...and guess what...it was in the 4th where you guys lost it...so yeah

we actually did do this exactly during playoff time, the game after we made the change was when we blew out the Mavs so we thought we fixed our problem. i guess not.


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#15 2009-03-09 02:08:38

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

FastAsATurtle wrote:

Slightly Hyphy wrote:

Did MG use Gym Rat at all this season?

This is something, that should be left to the beholder to figure out. You have all the info you need wink

i agree smile


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#16 2009-03-09 02:12:24

malice
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Whilst that is an incredible amount of points - very impressive, I'm not entirely sure that you losing equates to "the sim is broken".

Last edited by malice (2009-03-09 02:12:36)


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#17 2009-03-09 02:14:22

FastAsATurtle
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

malice wrote:

Whilst that is an incredible amount of points - very impressive, I'm not entirely sure that you losing equates to "the sim is broken".

I also agree with this. I would find it very interesting if there were a ton of "Manilla clones" next season, given the disappointment and frustration that Manilla went through this season.


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#18 2009-03-09 02:15:56

malice
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

FastAsATurtle wrote:

malice wrote:

Whilst that is an incredible amount of points - very impressive, I'm not entirely sure that you losing equates to "the sim is broken".

I also agree with this. I would find it very interesting if there were a ton of "Manilla clones" next season, given the disappointment and frustration that Manilla went through this season.

The thing is, they started with a team full of S1/2 vets (not entirely sure how many of each), which meant that they started with a relatively high TC level. 
This isn't a plan that 95% of CR could even attempt to implement.


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#19 2009-03-09 02:18:14

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

malice wrote:

Whilst that is an incredible amount of points - very impressive, I'm not entirely sure that you losing equates to "the sim is broken".

no but stat distribution is, and my guess what happened with that is this...

When kazz originally created the game he didn't have to worry about players stats being decided by anything but pre-adjusted attributes b/c there was no player chems or skills. But when skills and chems came out, kazz must have never updated it.

and this brings up a good question, will kazz fix it? or will this error continue to happen for those players who shift there main attribute?

FastAsATurtle also brought up another very good pt to me.
Not only did we get 120,000 but we didn't without any preparation the season before. Infact half the team switched roles.I guess gym ratting last season sort of helped but it would of been better if we would of trained our current main attribute up more.

Last edited by Wade_ (2009-03-09 02:20:45)


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#20 2009-03-09 02:21:40

DemonDeacs
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Maybe you losing is a GOOD thing for the sim.

To quickly explain:

The Celtics or Lakers can't win every game.  Sure, they are both hell of a team, but they won't go perfect. Some time they will be upset.  Now, I know, in the playoffs they don't get upset, but unfortunately, with a simulated game you can't have an "intensity" factor that brings your team past these upsets.

But, I need sleep, and I can talk more tomorrow.

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#21 2009-03-09 02:22:59

Camel
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

I think the alarm for me would have started to ring when the Reign Makers won the last quarter in your first playoff game; that'd be the signal to boost your leadership. But whilst I am surprised to see these stats and to see that you lost, I am also glad as it shows that this sim does not mean higher points = auto-win. Just sucks for you guys that TSS had a c***** while you had a downer. But that happens in every sport.


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#22 2009-03-09 02:23:25

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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Interesting. Unless TSS spent a lot of sp on Gym Rat, they are as good as, or better than, DF. So, if this represents your chem and skill levels for your last game against us, then I don't see it as that big of an upset, considering TSS is probably better (right now) than we were for that game.


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#23 2009-03-09 02:23:47

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

DemonDeacs wrote:

Maybe you losing is a GOOD thing for the sim.

To quickly explain:

The Celtics or Lakers can't win every game.  Sure, they are both hell of a team, but they won't go perfect. Some time they will be upset.  Now, I know, in the playoffs they don't get upset, but unfortunately, with a simulated game you can't have an "intensity" factor that brings your team past these upsets.

But, I need sleep, and I can talk more tomorrow.

agree, this proves the team with the highest sim pts won't automatically win.

I have to listen to the radio show again but i think the changes kazz mentioned for next season will really effect teams to go for a plan like this.


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#24 2009-03-09 02:24:44

malice
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Wade_ wrote:

malice wrote:

Whilst that is an incredible amount of points - very impressive, I'm not entirely sure that you losing equates to "the sim is broken".

no but stat distribution is, and my guess what happened with that is this...

When kazz originally created the game he didn't have to worry about players stats being decided by anything but pre-adjusted attributes b/c there was no player chems or skills. But when skills and chems came out, kazz must have never updated it.

and this brings up a good question, will kazz fix it? or will this error continue to happen for those players who shift there main attribute?

FastAsATurtle also brought up another very good pt to me.
Not only did we get 120,000 but we didn't without any preparation the season before. Infact half the team switched roles.I guess gym ratting last season sort of helped but it would of been better if we would of trained our current main attribute up more.

Fair point (on stat distribution), even so - "broken" is a word I wouldn't use.  And it's not really the reason you lost either - according to what you're asserting (unless I'm misreading you!), the points deciding result are working... but the distribution of stats aren't working as they should.

I'd guess their selection of team chems >> yours.  And I'd hazard a further guess that due to working so hard on player chems, you neglected (at least somewhat) your team chems.  Would that be a fair thing to say?

Last edited by malice (2009-03-09 02:25:18)


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#25 2009-03-09 02:27:23

Wade_
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Re: The Manilla tell all story :)

Camel wrote:

I think the alarm for me would have started to ring when the Reign Makers won the last quarter in your first playoff game; that'd be the signal to boost your leadership. But whilst I am surprised to see these stats and to see that you lost, I am also glad as it shows that this sim does not mean higher points = auto-win. Just sucks for you guys that TSS had a c***** while you had a downer. But that happens in every sport.

We had alot more leadership then what was posted. What was posted was what we had throughout most of the season. Then we realized teams had higher leadership then we thought so we adjusted.


We had close to 10,000 leadership when we played TSS, so i'm not sure if that was to big of a problem.
I personally think Defense was our biggest problem.


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